[Complete Tribunal] Piracy and Private Messages

[Shredman]

Moved By Kaz:
Tribunal Request Follows
-----------------------------------------

well there was another thread, no point in linking as i have the main issues quoted . and first off let me say , i have no problem not posting links here , i wanted to contiue my debate , and am trying to do so per Teanos Request. without disrupting a meaning less movie thread.


the rule i have no problem with...

the perception of how the rule is made and how it is enforced thats where i have a problem.

its not like we all dont know each other and have not talked on the boards, on im, in chats, and even on the phone...

before my link was edited there was 1 post about the link , and when it was edited i had no problem with that...

my problem came when my other post was edited when i said contact me and i will send you the link, and that brings us to here

movie theaters do not release movies, charge people for it, then give it to some website to stream so people can watch it for free. Please listen for once, and don't link, distribute, or talk about distributing that type of content on this board system.

Thanks.

you know i respect your views on this subject, even tho 80% of the rest of the world do not,,, as a musician, yes i would like ppl to buy my music, as the establishment , or a record co. ceo , thats all it is about is the money....

90% of the actual artist , just want their work , seen, heard, felt whatever....

Basicaly the only ppl that shareware is hurting are big biz assholes who already have more money than god.


Times are hard right now, ppl cant afford to take their familys out to movies , not without giving up a good meal for them the following week... 80% of the ppl in the USA anyway....

now to ask not to post links on this site, is your right , and i would honor that rule...
but to say no1 can contact me on pm to get a link to a non porn web site, is well Horse Shit....

between that and your the past never happened attitude , i think its time for you to look in the mirror man....

some things need to be censored , and yes maybe links to free movies should be one of them, along with porn, spam and other troll like activity ....

but lets not get carried away with the Elitist views , and assuming just because your view is dif that someone elses on this subject...or any other for that matter, that it will not be allowed or even talked about by members of this community .

Thats not cool bro


amazing , all this over Zombieland,

but it is kinda fitting, because if thats the way this community is going to be run, thats all that will be here, a bunch of Zombies.....

This has nothing to do with music. Music and Movies are two different subjects.
I asked you politely to not post that stuff on the boards, nor do I wish you to use Monarchs' Glen as a method of distributing it via posting, pm, or whatever else you may come up with.

If you have a problem with that, there's a tribunal forum for you to bring it up in. This isn't the place, so I will once again kindly ask you to stop.

_____________________________________


First off Music and Movies are both the Highest Grossing forms of Entertainment in the United States , and both are subject to the same laws where the internet is concerned .

like i have said 5 times now, i dont have a problem with the rule , i have a problem with the fact members of this community that have known each other for yrs cant talk about things even in pm because an admin doesnt agree with what they are talking about....and goes as far to call someone out and make them sound like a 1 time poster , posting links to 5 dollar porn sites...

[Nagash]

Point is that those making movies and/or music are missing out on a lot of income because of piracy, downloading, etc. It may be easy and socially accepted, but I do consider it stealing. You like the music, you buy the record. You like the movie, you go to the cinema or buy it on DVD. If you're not willing to buy it, then you don't like it enough.

It's a simple economic principle: if you don't think it's worth the price or if you can't afford it, then you are not entitled to it.

However, I think the problem with linking to streams doesn't lie as much in the stealing part itself, but more in the fact that the admin/owner of these boards is (are?) responsible for it. So if you link to something you shouldn't link to, the admin/mods must set you straight, lest they be held responsible for piracy and risk a fine or whatever the punishment may be. And therewith the whole site may even be at stake.

Same goes for posting nudity and/or porn, if memory serves.

So listen to the Teanos and keep it off these boards. If you insist on sharing the stuff, mail it to people.

[Gerien]

3. User Submissions

A. FreeStreamTube allows its users to submit video or other material and the hosting, sharing, and/or publishing of such submissions. You shall be solely responsible for your own submissions and the consequences of posting or publishing them. In connection with your submissions, you affirm/warrant that:

- you own or have the necessary licenses, rights, consents, and permissions to use and authorize FreeStreamTube Limited to use all patent, trademark, trade secret, copyright or other proprietary rights in and to all submissions to enable inclusion and use of the submissions in the manner contemplated by these terms of service; and you have the written consent, release, and/or permission of each and every identifiable person in the submission to use the name or likeness of each individual for use in your submissions in the manner contemplated by these terms of service. You retain all of your ownership rights in your submissions. However, by submitting the material to FreeStreamTube, you grant a worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, sublicenseable and transferable license to use, reproduce, distribute, prepare derivative works of, display, and perform the submission in connection with the FreeStreamTube website and business. The license granted by you terminates once you delete the submission from the FreeStreamTube website.

B. You further agree that you will not:

- submit material that is copyrighted, protected by trade secret or otherwise subject to third party proprietary rights, including privacy and publicity rights, unless you are the owner of such rights or have permission from their rightful owner to post the material and to grant FreeStreamTube Limited all of the license rights granted herein;

IOW, while the site may (and I do mean may) have protected itself, whomever loaded up Zombieland is breaking the law. So yes, Teanos, Kaz, and Gili could be sued for providing links to illegally reproduced material on that website from theirs.

This doesn't go any deeper than current law, Shredman, sorry. I wish it were otherwise -as a librarian, I have some unique perspectives on copyright - but for now these guys have to obey the law.

[Archangel]

like i have said 5 times now, i dont have a problem with the rule , i have a problem with the fact members of this community that have known each other for yrs cant talk about things even in pm because an admin doesnt agree with what they are talking about....and goes as far to call someone out and make them sound like a 1 time poster , posting links to 5 dollar porn sites...

Remember that pm's are part of the forums. If this site were to come under investigation for suspected piracy, and they were subpoenaed for their database records, those links posted in pm's would be included in that, and as such, the board providers would be held responsible. There is some back and forth about whether a content provider is responsible for the content posted, but even if found not guilty, the monetary damages done via defending that lawsuit would be staggering.

While IM's would of course be exempt, as they have nothing to do with Monarchy Games, it's still spiting in the face of the "don't post piracy" rule.

As others noted, this is strictly a legal CYA decision, not a personal decision, whether personal feelings factored in or not.

[Kaz]

I left this for a few days to see if anyone would post.

Shred,

What do you honestly want to try and change with this Tribunal?

Are you expecting a game site to have a rule that says "Pornography, Piracy or other illegal material is not allowed. (except when sent to a mate via Private Message because staff cant read them and wont know)"

??

[Nagash]

LMAO


That would be an original turn to take though.

[Teanos]

So whats the deal on this? I've stayed silent since the majority of it was in regards to me.

From a pure administrative stand point - anything that breaks federal and international law has to be censored here. Its not my rule, its just the way it is. By providing a link to a website that is violating a law (primarly US since we are based there), puts anyone and everyone involved in owning/running/paying for this place in a bad spot. It has always been this way.

Unfortunately there is no such thing as "private messages", even on a message board system. That content is still stored in a database, and even if it was encrypted it can still be used, accessed, and decoded. If its against the law, or its against common decency, you probably shouldn't write it and post it on the internet - no matter how private you think it is.

To be perfectly honest we push the envelope a bit by allowing you all to use icons of images and graphics that are copyrighted. In all honesty that should probably be disallowed as well for the same reasons.

I hold the same standards on any board/site I own, administrate, or have any control over.

From a pure personal standpoint - Don't really have anything to say as this was never personal on my behalf.

So can this be closed, or is there more debating to be had?

[Gerien]

Given that Shred has not replied to Kaz's question, I don't think there was ever any real debate to be had big guy. It's illegal to post those links here, period. Not a decision anyone here has any say in.

[Teanos]

Fair enough, I don't see the harm in leaving this open for another 24/48 hours to see if there are any final arguements to be made.

[Venus]

thats the thing
there cant be any final arguments
its against laws
/shrugs

there was never any other answer other than u cant do it here.
i mean
right?

[Shredman]

i think everyone missed my whole point here.... but yea just let it die....

[Kaz]

If you had a point you feel we missed, remake it in a different way.

That's the point of this forum.

[Teanos]

i have a problem with the fact members of this community that have known each other for yrs cant talk about things even in pm because an admin doesnt agree with what they are talking about....and goes as far to call someone out and make them sound like a 1 time poster , posting links to 5 dollar porn sites...

Shred, is this the part you wanted to focus on more? As Kaz pointed out, if you feel that we have not discussed the point you were trying to make then by all means please continue. This is meant as a means of solving conflict, not letting the conflict linger, or build up.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that I think you were more upset with being edited and having an administrator post publicly about what you did wrong. Would it be better for an admin/moderator to make the edit/closure as they see fit, and then contact the offender in private? Would that be less insulting?

I'm all for coming up with new and/or different ways to deal with disputes (hence Tribunal), after all we are still writing the rules to govern this place.

If you really do want to drop it then thats fine with us as well, just let us know.

[Shredman]

i would say thats a very fair view of my point, and nah i dont wont it to linger , just by saying this , is see you see where i am coming from, and no hard feelings will ever build, we have known each other to long for that, and both have pissed each other off many times before over the yrs,


and by no means am i saying oh you should be nicer to me or crying i am being treated unfairly ....

i broke a rule, that was my stupidity ....

but it could have been handled better . by me aswell, i just want to move on, i am sure we will all , not just me and you but everyone here, do something to piss someone off at 1 time or another....


i was wrong for posting the link, and looks like the point i was tring to make was heard and answered ....which is muchhhhhhhhhhh better than the way things use to be....you can lock er up anytime you see fit....

[Teanos]

With that said we will go ahead and close this one out.